Starting off 3D game development?

[Wiredbomb0]

Hey there everyone! Been looking at this site for a while, so I thought I should join up. Don't take this as some noob that has come to ask 'where is a program that makes the game for me'. Been game creation for about 5 years now, and I want to get into the 3D aspect.

So, in your opinion, what would be the best place to start? I've been reading posts about learning DirectX and using that as a method, but I was kind of hoping to find an engine that might be a little...simplier, then DirectX. So, what would your thoughts be as a good place to start 3D?

I've got an idea/concept for a game, and I'm going to ask a freind at my school if he would like to help me (I usually go to him for his opinion on a game I'm creating) in creating this (Texturing, Modelling, Programming is too much for a single guy). So, the idea is an RTS (and no, I'm not going to even suggest the M word ;D ) so is there any updated RTS engines that are available that I could use that is 'free' (I'm only 16 so spending about $750 for an engine is a little out of my league).

Apart from that, I wish everyone a good week and thanks in advance!

[fireside]

You could think about a mod from a game you like, like maybe Oblivion, otherwise use a general purpose engine. Check the open source engines list in the engine database. Any of them will work. Ogre is good, along with Panda3d. The Blender game engine is a good starter engine but probably wouldn't work for an RTS. You could also look at Glest, which is a real time strategy engine. It would have a lot more underlying code built in. Something like Glest or a Mod would make the project a lot more doable.

[Wiredbomb0]

You could also look at Glest

I would admit, I did look into Glest to see if it would work, and I think it might. Just wanting to know, cause that it's free, what would the license be under? GNU? I like this engine, but would there be anything wrong with using it (like, people saying that this person used an engine, rather writing his own?)

Thanks for the suggestion!

[fireside]

I would assume it's gpl. It doesn't say on the site. To give you some idea of the work involved, I'm pretty sure they have been working on that game for over 5 years now. The way they have it set up, the work you do would be separate from the engine so I don't think you would have to take on the gpl license unless you wanted to with your own work. You could probably manage to do a simple strategy type game with a general purpose engine, but an advanced RTS would probably overwhelm you unless you are an uber programmer. Even if you were thinking about it, a Glest game would be a good introduction into what you need.
If you have written an rts in 2d, however, it would not be too big a step to use a general purpose 3d engine.
I like this engine, but would there be anything wrong with using it (like, people saying that this person used an engine, rather writing his own?)

You have to forget about that kind of thing if you want to actually make a game that people will play. There's an enormous amount of work involved and you need to cut as many corners as possible. You either need to cut down on the scope, make a smaller game with less features, or use an engine with as much base code as possible.

[starstutter]

(and no, I'm not going to even suggest the M word ;D )
:worthy:

I like this engine, but would there be anything wrong with using it (like, people saying that this person used an engine, rather writing his own?)

Maybe from a few other developers, but I seriously doubt any of the end players would care. The vast majority of games (with the exception of Epic and Valve, off the top of my head) buy most of their rendering tech.

If you're asking if you should write your own engine or not, that's a more complicated answer.

Let me try to put the pros and cons out here real quick (I've needed to refine my list anyway):

Why you should:
- There's no greater learning experience. You can learn vast amounts about general programming archatecture, math, inner graphics tech (black-box stuff), shaders and well... if they're in games, you name it!

- Since you're young, now is the best time to take the risk to learn all the gritty details of game engines. Right now you have the abillity to invest a lot of time (risk free) in writing the engine. When you get older, that option starts slowly vanishing and time managment of learning the complex technology will become far more difficult.

- Achievement. There's not a lot of people that successfuly write a real, working game engine that can be used to make something playable. You will have teh Uber bragging rights.

- If you manage to complete an engine, you will know it inside and out. You'll be able to fix possible bugs and develop the majority of the game way faster than you could with unfamiliar tech.

- Writing graphics tech will become incredibly easy after learning it. As a personal example of this, I have written 2 engines so far. The first one looks good but (I'll admit) its a clustered mound of crap. The architecture was so sloppy that it was almost unusable. I was sad to toss it because I worked on it for over a year, but when I started a new engine with a far FAR superior format (about 1/80th of the time spent debugging), I was able to whip out the visual equivelant of my previous tech in about 1 month.

- Legal issues. Its very easy to get in trouble with legal technicalities when using someone elses high-level technology

Why you shouldn't:
- If you're an artist with not a whole lot of interest in the technology side

- If you have a tight deadline (or are just real short on time)

- If your main goal is to be a designer (even though I STRONGLY encourage you to read some posts here about that)

- If your goal is to get familiar with established and standardized graphics tech (not a bad idea)

- If you just really really don't want to :)

[Wiredbomb0]

Why you should:
- There's no greater learning experience.

Yeah, I know that would be awesome to learn how it works

- Since you're young, now is the best time to take the risk to learn all the gritty details of game engines.

I've got a bit of free time to spend, but I know the general idea of how it works.

- Achievement. There's not a lot of people that successfuly write a real, working game engine that can be used to make something playable. You will have teh Uber bragging rights.

Can't agree more.

- If you manage to complete an engine, you will know it inside and out. You'll be able to fix possible bugs and develop the majority of the game way faster than you could with unfamiliar tech.

- Writing graphics tech will become incredibly easy after learning it.

That would have been easy.

- Legal issues. Its very easy to get in trouble with legal technicalities when using someone elses high-level technology.

Yeah, but I've checked out the license and it's all good to use it in anyway, aslong as I say thanks to the Glest Team.

Why you shouldn't:
- If you're an artist with not a whole lot of interest in the technology side

I'm not really fused about the technology, aslong as it works

- If you have a tight deadline (or are just real short on time)

Deadline? What deadline? :D

- If your main goal is to be a designer (even though I STRONGLY encourage you to read some posts here about that)

My main goal is to be the lead programmer, but will probably end up doing everything, because I haven't really got anyone else that is in sync with that I'm doing (I've got a friend who I go to every now and again for his point of view on something)

- If your goal is to get familiar with established and standardized graphics tech (not a bad idea)

It's not really a goal that I had in mind, so yeah.

- If you just really really don't want to :)

I can't be bothered, basically, knowing how long it takes (I've made a 3D engine in Game Maker, that could load levels and such, and that took ages.

I think I'll just download the Glest engine, and credit it to them later. Okay guys, thanks for your advice! I'll let you know when I have a demo up and running!