Community Project

[Lord_Raven]

I have noticed from reading through many of the posts in this forum, that many of you are looking for help in your own projects, so why don't we all as members of this site come together and start a project to with as many ideas as we can come up with, and with all of this knowledge and the highly skilled people in here, we should be able to come up with something pretty clever. Not to mention when working as a team, you could learn so many things in so many aspects, instead of just learning programming, or just learning modeling/texturing, etc.

I think this would be a good "Tutorial" for everyone to be able to learn and have fun, and when it is complete to be able to share the same excitement of creating a game that we like, that we get when playing a game that we like.

Well, that is my piece for the year, so give me feedback, on what you think?

~Korey~

[Methulah]

When things like this have been tried in the past, they usually haven't gone that well. However, I am not against it, as fundimentally it is a good idea. It would need to have a strong leadership and the like, and a good way of filtering people who will not contribute,

[Lord_Raven]

I agree but at the same time, if everyone had access to the project files that were updated by the designated "leader", say on a website. Then even if they don't contribute, they can view the code, and make suggestions.

[anubis]

There was such a project on devmaster and it failed for numerous reasons (devmaster was very young, we didn't have a lot of people). Almost nobody had the time to contribute on a regular basis. I like the idea very much though and would see what i can contribute but knowing my schedule during semester times I can't say how much that will be. The key point clearly is a lead that is willing to contribute a lot of time to the project.

[Lord_Raven]

or group of leaders to work together, so as not to pressure one person into having to do too much.

[baldurk]

Having a group of leaders to me defies the point of having a leader in the first place.

I say good luck to you, but like last time I don't think you'll get very far.

[Methulah]

I'm in the same boat. Good luck, and if it works, great. But I will always be the sceptic.

[Mihail121]

Although i already know the result of a such attempt, I will gladly try once more!

[anubis]

As there doesn't seem to be any person volunteering for a lead I think this isn't going to go anywhere :)

[Lord_Raven]

well If I don't find one, I will assume the position. After all, It's about having fun while doing the thing you like to do, not about who is in charge, or how many professionals are on the team, just have fun, and learn a few things along the way, and at the same time design something to show for all the time you have spent talking about the things you would like to be able to do.

[anubis]

Well... it is also about knowing what has to be done. Unfortunatly having fun is only one part of the equation. Unless you aren't working alone and communication with others doesn't matter or you are making tetris, things aren't going to work out if nobody has the experience to keep a project together. Just naming someone as leader isn't going to cut I'm afraid. Don't get me wrong. I'd really like to support any effort of a community project but I don't have the time to put my full time into this.

[Lord_Raven]

I am not asking you alone to help, just anyone who wants to just dive in and try, because that is the only way you learn anything, I would lead the project because i have lead a project very similar to this one, with much fewer people, and i taught the people what to do, so it is not hard, I just figured someone with more programming experience than myself would want to help.

[anubis]

I'm sorry... I'm not trying to put you down. Somehow this went into the wrong direction. Let's call it accumulated pesimism regarding these "projects" :)

[Lord_Raven]

I see, well, im going to go ahead and start working on some things for the project anyone who would like to participate, please leave me a PM, or an email at RavenCruse@aol.com

[Methulah]

I'm sorry... I'm not trying to put you down. Somehow this went into the wrong direction. Let's call it accumulated pesimism regarding these "projects" :)

Always the pesimist?

I have to say, I am not too crash hot on these projects, I have seen them fail pretty badly. They've worked before too, so it is always worth a try. If I see it going well, I'll poke my head in, see what needs to be done.

[bladder]

I have a suggestion:

Why not first try putting a plan into the devmaster wiki. First set some goals for the project. For instance suppose you create w category in the wiki called "devmaster project" or whatever. within the category you have a few pages:

1) Requirements page
- Should be cross platform - mac/win/linux OR
- .Net framework compatible
- It will be used to create a role playing game
- 3 dimentional engine/isometric engine/whatever
- must support scripting

Basically this page should state what is the aim of the project, what are it's goals. Is it just an engine? Is it an engine which will be used for a game? what game? WHat features will it have?

2) Engine design page
- Components of the engine
- How the modules are connected
- What objects the compnents will have
- coding standards and organization

This page will have the entire engine design. How the engine will work internally. What layers does the engine have? What modules are within the layers? and what components are within the modules?

3) Game design
- The story
- the in game script if any
- Characters
- blah blah blah

You probably get the idea. So maybe try putting something like that in the wiki, let it go for a few months and see if a solid design can be flushed out of people. AFAIK nothing like this has been tried before - an open game engine standard or something. I think there's more of a chance of it failing, but then there's also a chance that it may work.

The more knowledgable people that visit the wiki will be able to catch small crack additions and their contribution while minimal, will at least keep the design realistic...I think.

Anyway, it's just an idea, open for discussions.

[anubis]

That sounds like a very reasonable idea...

[shiaolin_monk]

You do realize...IF the Devmaster community manages to pull this off... it could be the next most recognized low-down in the game community. Theoretically, The fourms are already divided into the groups needed to make a game and phycologically speaking, people who participate in those specific fourms would have some experience in it. I don't mind leading, I've always had good leadership skills. The only problem is, I'm still in school so a) My time is cut in half and b) There are people here way better then me c) I'm sure nobody likes to listen to a high school kid d) I'm not greatly multi-skilled. I'm not saying i'm 100% with you, since i've got troubles of my own, but IF there needs to be a person to spark the fire, I might do it.

I currently have a basic DirectX 9 engine that is fully extendable (since its still pre-mature). It is in C# but with a little patience, I don't see how we can't use C++ managed based around the C# version. I am actually trying to make the same thing in C++ (managed) but since it doesn't tell me where the heck I go wrong while typing, the common fustration of 'ERROR's come up and I have to fix it.

But I seriously think that if there where to be a fire starter and the leader, it should respectivly be you, Ed_Mack, Methullah, anubis and other DevMaster admins.

' The world's first global, cross region game....
' The world's first global, cross platform game engine...

[Ed Mack]

If this is to be done, use a well known and mature engine.

[Mihail121]

I even kinda have a game idea: "Chicken Farm". It's basically supposed to be a cell-shaded chicken game, which fits in all known genres: FPS, RTS, Adventure, Quest, RPG, MMORPG, etc. If you want i can start writing some basic docs on it.

NOTE:

I don't say this is the game that should be worked on!!!!

edit: since the game should be cross-platform, the models will be as rude as possible (MD2s with not more than 300 polys per chicken, 20 oder so keyframes) i suggest writing a software rasterizer or using nick's swShader.

[shiaolin_monk]

This may take more thinking then required. Well I'll confess. I havn't seen many console type games on pc. So, I am making my own. We need to focus on one genre and I really think FPS and stratagy games have been milked alot. I think this would work, but we have lack of knowledge about each other and nobody here has time to kill. Generally speaking, I think i'm the least experienced programmer here, so I'm talking half gamer half programmer. I'm going to go with the staff on this one so if they're ready, I'll try and join. I don't think i'm any use, but i have a long range of gaming experience.

[Lord_Raven]

well, im not an expert or anything as far as programming, and knowing exactly what engine to use and such, but i learn very fast. if anyone has a decent Engine, and language, announce it, if anyone has good modeling skills, announce it, if you have any map building skills, or can set up the server (if we are doing an MMOG, Just for DevMaster.Net Members), or can do anything for that matter let us know, so we can start making a list of skill sets to assign different parts, and then we will discuss what kind of game, and such later, till then, we need to find out what each is good at, and what each is capable of. So lets start Listing


I am proficient at modeling/texturing non-char related objects, and world design as well, as a web-site designer, and i can program in C, VB, Html, PhP, and im currently learning RUBY and mor of C at the same time, I can probably contribute 20 or 30 hours a week to this project.

Who's Next?

[Lord_Raven]

http://www.devmaster.net/wiki/Current_events

this is the new highlight for this project

its a start anyways.

[anubis]

To make this work the first order of business is : Keep it simple ! Don't even think about anything as complex as a FPS. The moto clearly should be : Small and innovative. Let it not require a lot of artwork. Things are going lucky if we have one ore more real artists. Maybe you can set up a new page and category in the wiki for the project, instead of using the Current Events page. If you can set up another page to collect game ideas. If you don't know how to do that tell me and I'll do it.

[Ed Mack]

I second anubis. Lets try to keep the workload to a minimum, and focus on creating something different. A mini-game.

[shiaolin_monk]

So i'm with the staff with this one. Mini-games are cool. Wario Ware is a good example of a fun mini-game. Such a game won't need a commercial engine and a licence to cough up.

I can be a tester. I can play the game and see what could be improved and what is good. I could help out but really i'm just a crap programmer so i'll leave it to the big cheese groups.

[Mihail121]

I second Ed Mack. Lets try to create something with crappy graphics, perhaps not the best sound, but with the best possible gameplay. I believe it's pretty possible!

[anubis]

The graphics don't even have to be crappy. If we have on modeller we can surely get two or three decent models but if you start to think about crazy 3d environments you suddenly need 100+ models and that's just not realistc. We could also go for some procedural, organic themed stuff.

[shiaolin_monk]

The graphics don't even have to be crappy. If we have on modeller we can surely get two or three decent models but if you start to think about crazy 3d environments you suddenly need 100+ models and that's just not realistc. We could also go for some procedural, organic themed stuff.

Thats true. You can do a 'guess the ace' or 'guess the cup with the ball' trick in 3D. Slap on some good textures on some polys and you wouldn't really get a bad game graphics. I do model, but it takes me forever to make something and I still haven't mastered texturing. So does this mean the senior members and staff are in? I know anubis, methulah and mihail121 are in. I'm waiting on ed_mack and bladder to join. If they do, i'm in. B)

[Methulah]

We coulod easily make procedural generators to make an anime themes RPG style game, even in 3D. Someone pested a 3D tree gnereator, it was simple, but with a bit of work it could have done the job. While it may be deplorable, there have been good texture collections around for a while that are cheap and quite good. I can see this working, even with decent graphics,as long as the majority of the stuff is handled by procedural generators.

[Ed Mack]

I'm in, although like others my time isn't great. Is there a Wiki page to brainstorm?

[Lord_Raven]

Ok, I will get with Anubis on the Brainstorming Page, and have something for everyone to post their ideas and thoughts, I personally would like to see a multi-level game with a different look, and feel than most 5.0 rating games...perhaps we could do a mini-game that isn't so repetitive such as "Guess the Cup With The Ball Trick", I think it would be nice to see something with a living environment, and maybe something not so defined in what you can or cannot do in the game, but make it more of a tour for people who would like to see what this game development community can do.

[Methulah]

I agree, we can make a game that isn't limited, because we do have a lot of coding/design talent here.

[Lord_Raven]

Please Visit The link A few posts down from this one, lol , Thanks ED_MACK

[Methulah]

The text got deleted. Start one on devmaster's own dmWiki. Getting WikiMedia to host a brainstorm page for us is unfair.

[shiaolin_monk]

Alright I'm in. I like the idea of anime because our reference photos can come from drawings and modelling cartoons take up less polys. I'll post some ideas on the brainstorm place.

*edit* somehow i can't log into WiKi

[Ed Mack]

http://www.devmaster.net/wiki/Brainstorming

There ya go

[Lord_Raven]

Thank You Ed - Your a Gentleman, and a scholar

[Methulah]

Nah, he isn't. He is a mouse and a staplegun.

[Lord_Raven]

lol, well, i'll let you 2 fight over which it is...

[Methulah]

I lose. I always do.

[Lord_Raven]

lol, figures

[bladder]

Since you guys are going to be using the wiki, I'd suggest you make the page names a bit more concrete. Instead of "Brainstorming" make it "DMNC_Project_Brainstorming". Prepend all project specific pages with the word "DMNC_Project" or something - as in "DevMaster.Net Community Project" (don't forget to add the word community, else it may be a bit misleading)

[Ed Mack]

I was using [[Category:Community Project]] to brand them, but if you feel they will cluter the namespace, is there a way to make our own (like Help:Editing, Project:Brainstorming)?

[shiaolin_monk]

:angry: grr Theres a problem with me logging into WiKi. I'll see what the problem is but in the meantime, anyone got any suggestions?

[Lord_Raven]

You shouldn't have to log into the wiki, to see the pages should you? i haven't been anyways.

[bladder]

I'm sure there's a way :) Will have to look into how though.

[Lord_Raven]

Just Click On This Link: http://www.devmaster.net/wiki/Brainstorming#Launching_ideas

[Axehilt]

Hey, I probably won't help out much but hopefully a little critique will be helpful, with a few brainstormed ideas thrown in...

Coverage Gaps
Firstly, as I think someone already stated, the game you attempt to create needs to be fitting of the skills of the group. The two main roles I see lacking so far are Sound, and 3D Animator (unless the people who listed themselves as modellers can also do animations.) Granted, you can still make a game look great, even a 3D game, without 3D animations - but you have to have a plan on what you're going to do, how it's going to look. Sound/music can be entirely ignored, but I feel it's a very important "polish" item for a game - good sounds can really help make a game fun.

For music/sound, one possible avenue of picking up another team member is to post in the discussion forums at http://www.modarchive.com/ I've noticed many requests (and responses) for game music there. Musicians are looking to create a portfolio just like game programmers are. (:

For 3D animation, you'd either have to learn it, find another person who can do it, or design your art style around that limitation. Either 2D art or 3D art without detailed animations can look great if done right. While I wasn't fond of Parappa's (http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/puzzle/parappatherapper2/) art style, the technical way they implemented the visuals might be one option (2D animated textures moving around a 3D world).

AI (artificial intelligence) is another potential limiting factor. Again, one of the programmers could dive in and take a crash course in AI programming - or you could simply have the game design require only minimal AI programming. Given that all of the projects I've been on (stuff like Rise of Nations and Mechwarrior 4) have had dedicated AI programmers, I assume it would be a really attractive thing for an aspiring game programmer to have on their resume. (:

Brainstormed Game Ideas

1. Synthesized. (bizarre/unique-ish game) Part MP3 visualization program, part Asteroids-style shooter. The player selects one of his own MP3s. Enemies are generated based on the music (perhaps with a visual equalizer). The background (and possibly the "walls" of the level) would also be changed by the music. Vaguely similar to Rez (http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/rez/), and very similar to a rare (Dreamcast?) game that used your own music CDs in sort of Rythm/Platformer style gameplay.

Anyways, these types of games generally impress gaming enthusiasts by feeling very different from anything else they've played. It's also a relatively simple concept that shouldn't be too difficult to create. Other forms of gameplay besides an Asteroids-style shooter would certainly be possible.

2. Necrosis. (FPS survival horror) Zombies attack and you must survive in a Mall from dusk til dawn until military backup saves you.

* Zombies infinitely spawn throughout the mall.
-----* The player can limit zombie movement by barricading certain areas of the map. Barricades are eventually broken by zombies.
* Some areas of the mall should be poorly lit, and many areas should look ravaged by zombies.
* Weapons/Ammo are limited. Because zombies infinitely spawn, this forces the player to keep on the move to find more ammo.
-----* hunting rifle in the sports store
-----* aerosol can + lighter in the hair boutique
-----* Katana in the Kendo Training Center
-----* pistols off dead security guards - including zombie security guards that spawn occasionally.
* Item powerups provide temporary and permanent effects
-----* food court food restores health
-----* cookies/candy provide temporary run speed increases
-----* books provide permanent bonuses for weapons
----------* The Kendo Master's Handbook increases Katana damage
----------* The Anarchist's Cookbook increases aerosal flamethrower fuel efficiency
----------* So you want to be a Security Guard increases pistol accuracy.

If you don't mind campy cheese factor, have each project member submit voiceovers for the zombies, using their best zombie impersonation. "Braaaainnssss", zombie moans, and so on.

Zombies is a relatively untapped FPS theme compared to Space Marines, Aliens, Modern Military, and WW2. There are like three half-life mods focused on them, but that's about it.

To make it even less like anything currently produced, have it be in medieval times as a Paladin defending a village from an undead attack. And then implement a solid melee system that works less like a Half-life crowbar and more like Jedi Knight 2's excellent lightsaber mechanics.

And remember, this is still just a single level - to keep things simple. If it's smooth sailing and everyone is working well, then adding more levels and cooperative multiplayer might be good options (although if multiplayer is added as an afterthought, it'll probably be more trouble than it's worth.)

Alright, I've rambled on for long enough; sorry to invade your thread. :P

[SpreeTree]

1. Synthesized. (bizarre/unique-ish game) Part MP3 visualization program, part Asteroids-style shooter. The player selects one of his own MP3s. Enemies are generated based on the music (perhaps with a visual equalizer). The background (and possibly the "walls" of the level) would also be changed by the music. Vaguely similar to Rez (http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/rez/), and very similar to a rare (Dreamcast?) game that used your own music CDs in sort of Rythm/Platformer style gameplay.


Very nice idea, something that on one hand is quite simple (the asteroids part) but on the other is very different. Regardless of the target audience, games like this are fun to play, and ppl, if it is done right, can get a real buzz out of it.

I'm changing my vote!

Spree

[razi3l]

My friend write a few stories for game, so if everyone is interested i can post it.
They are pretty good. The only problem is that i must translate it to english.

[bramz]

Will brian fellows be on the lighting team?

[Ed Mack]

Please do post them!

[Methulah]

Unfortunatly, IBF hasn't made his appearance known yet. I wait.

[Ed Mack]

(Please don't hijack this thread! Use the Lounge)

[Lord_Raven]

Hey Guys, just checking back with you all, I have been working on designing a 2D engine for a New Game studio in New Zealand, but while i have been working on that, i have been checking on how many people volunteered, i think we have enough now, so lets use 3D game studio, its quick to design with and simple to use, the programmers will love it, nice and easy, however it is only a 30-day trial, but you guys will love it, so lets use this Demo of A6 engine found at www.3dgamestudio.com

What do you guys think, at least we would all be using the same thing to add our own ideas to, also it is very VERY easy to learn..... :-)

[Ed Mack]

Lets not rely on cracked software for a community project. It does not represent DevMaster's stance.

[Methulah]

And 3D Gamemaker isn't very powerful or versitile. We could use Quake 3 and add to it.

[SpreeTree]

A Half-Life2/Doom 3 mod might be more fitting maybe? At least then we have something to work with from the start?

Spree

[Methulah]

I am making a half-life 2 mod that would be stylish and signify what the community is about. I think artistic talent woudl be the sticking point though. If anyone is intersted, I can post more info though.

[Mihail121]

What about the UT3 engine? I think it's simple enough to use and besides, I know HTML, we can conduct a great game!!!!

[Methulah]

point taken.

[carebear]

Just thought I would chip in. I have got +/-9yrs programming xp. I started with VB and I moved to C# when the beta came out (what was that, 2001?). Just send me a msg on jonathancdickinson at gmail dot com if you need my assistance, I really like the idea of this...

[carebear]

Btw, I thought I would just say that we can expect to go nowhere if we don't get some documentation done. Someone should start a wiki and we should just all go in and start adding ideas. Heck, maybe even a new folder should be added for this project that that we can create some threads based around different game ideas and see which gets the most attention.

[fringe]

Hi there is already one at

http://www.devmaster.net/wiki/Category:Community_Project

thanks to Lord_Raven.

Talking of which can I steel some of the pertinent posts from here and put them in the Wiki?

fringe

[Anjel]

Im not sure how old this thread is but i have been coming up with ideas etc for a game for awhile, just started writing them all down last week but i have some graphics knowledge and i'd definitely like to donate some time to the project if anyone else was willing

[Reedbeta]

Thanks Anjel, unfortunately the community project idea is pretty much dead by now.

[Anjel]

Well then, if there is no community project, are there any programmers artists etc who would still like to make a game? if so we can get together, even if most of the community doesnt want to be involved^^
post back or message me
AIM: TheSerenityAnjel
MSN: Poetry_Writer717@hotmail.com
Yahoo: Loves_Anjel17

[Jynks]

Is this idea on the trash heap now??

[monjardin]

Yes: Community Project Inquiry (http://www.devmaster.net/forums/showthread.php?t=4683)

[simons1321]

i know some great programmers who might be interested, pm me

[baldurk]

i know some great programmers who might be interested, pm me

This project is over, dead. It has ceased to be worked on, bereft of supporters it rests in peace.

I think this thread should follow suit.